Draft: https://www.dropbox.com/s/bua2nbw8gq9xl0k/2ndgathering.xlsx?dl=0 Mirror: http://www.mediafire.com/file/zs39j7yl2kdcsjk/2ndGathering.xlsx/file More raw data: First Part: https://pastebin.com/2TykQLvT Second Part: https://pastebin.com/DBWsuVMe v0.54.2 Changes: Iris and Megail affection changes have been added to the results for the cooking event. Orcsphere now increases the level of your orcs by 2 and gives +3 Balia Final Points, but Balia Final Points check thresholds have been changed to 23/20/17/11. Error/Mistake/Missed: Missing Orilise +2 for talking witrh her in the start of day 5 before interact with the armor. v0.54.1 Change Spotted Succubus Council: a. Succubus Counicl score Gathering Influence threshold 15+ -> 16+ b. Slavery Check [15+|14-10|9-] -> [20+|19-12|11-] c. Orgasmic Overall [30+|29-]:[lamia switch,Overall+1|-] -> [32+|31-28|27-]:[lamia switch,Overall+2|Overall+1|-] DK Chamber: Riala {day7} -> Permanent Council [On|Off]: Riala [+5|+2] Elite Fight: Add the ability to Escape Fight against Nalili's Team. Anak Gauntlet: Open No Chest During the Race Gauntelt +2 -> +3 Nyst Battleground: a. Blocked Item. b. Starting Mana {400} + Harem [27|26-25|24|23|22|21-]: Mana [+250|+200|+150|+100|+50] c. No interaction with LL && [Vunne Talk] On and End the section -> [Press LL|Non-aggression]: [Press LL On|Vunne Agreement, Vunne +2] d. End Result: [Press LL] On : LL Node -1 Alabaster Hall {day7}: a. Gathering Influence [20+|19-15|14-10|9-5|4-]: Gathering Overall [+6|+4|+2|+0|-1] b. Gathering Rodak [10+|9-4|3-]: Gathering Overall[+2|+1|+0] c. Gathering Orgasmic [15+|14-10|9-]: Gathering Overall[+2|+1|+0] d. Gathering Philon [8+|7-3|2-]: Gathering Overall[+2|+1|+0] e. Each IK investigation: Gathering Overall+1 f. Gathering Overall: 14+: Orgasmic {country} +3, Ghenalon +3, Erosia +1, Rodak {country} +1, Gathering Philon +4 13-11: [Light] On, Orgasmic {country} +1, Ghenalon +1, Gathering Philon +2 10-7: [Heavy] On, Orgasmic {country} -2, Ghenalon -1, Erosia -1, Rodak {country} -1, Gathering Philon -1 6-: [Heavy] On, Orgasmic {country} -5, Ghenalon -3, Erosia -2, Rodak {country} -2, Gathering Philon -3 Yhilin: Dari 4th wheel 3+ -> Dari +5 Vunne 7+ && Gathering Rodak [5+|4-2|1-] -> LL Harem [Saved|Parital|None] v0.54.0: Last Resolution for Gathering Influence/Orgasmic/Rodak/Philon are missing the value Changed the Orc Magic Threshold for Orc Competition [7/5/3 -> 8/6/4] Add Gathering Rodak +2 to the choice to doesn't change Esthera Orgy (opposed to zirantian/slave plan) v0.53.3 Change Spotted: Best Result in Orc Solo Fight: Add , Gathering Influence +2 Reworked Impaler Buff for Tak'Kan Wild Kills From [ 2- | 3+ ] -> [ ATK+5/AGI+5 | --- ] to [5+ | 4-3 | 3- ] -> [ATK-5/AGI-5 |ATK+5/AGI+5 | ATK+10/AGI+10 ] Change End Threshold for orc sapience from [ 9+ | 8-7 | 6-5 | 4- ] to [ 12+ | 11-10 | 9-8 | 7- ] Change End Threshold for orc attractiveness from [ 8+ | 7-6 | 5-4 | 3-] to [ 9+ | 8-7 | 6-5 | 4- ] Ginasta RP change for decision about Empress' Orgy: [ Slave Plan On | Zirantian Plan On | Both Off] -> Ginasta RP [+3|+1|-5] v0.53.2 Change Spotted: None in the Internal math. Error Spotted: From 0.53.1 Xestris will show up in the gauntlet recon section if [Orgy: Slave Plan] is On, not only [Orgy: Zirantian Plan] is On. both require the interaction with her during the erosia invasion. v0.53.1 Change Spotted: Fixed Orgasmic Empire Champion Switch [solo fight] Added the Ability to "leave" the Battle with the Orgasmic Empire Champion [solo fight] Added Tower Delving Research Done / Started: Anak Gauntlet +2/+1 Changed Score For Chests Open: [ 0 | 1-2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 ]: Anak Gauntlet [ +2 | +0 | +1 | +2 | +3 | +4 | +5 ] Changed Final Score Threshold: From [ 11 | 10 | 9-8 | 7-6 | 5-3 | 2- ] To [ 13 | 12-11 | 10-9 | 8-6 | 5-3 | 2- ] Error Spotted: Going Through the Non Mandatory Examination Spell without Having Spot it is Anak Gauntlet -1 Chests Content Change Before and During the Race, Full List of Contents Added

FlayWind Btw, what's the best order of the investigations? We have 6 targets and only 5 opportunities to do so. You can't talk to Mestan directly after the Anak's event. Also what happens with Skullpounder room after Tanurak replaces him? Mestan only gives you 5 affection and +1 to Dari's counter. I guess he can be somewhat safely ignored, unless there's going to be a check soon that would require max possible affection with him. It's not clear how important Dari's counter is. Aside from that Fuzkao currently does not affect anything it seems, but maybe there will be a check in the future. after anak gauntlet skullpounder room are blocked. at the moment all investigation are equivalent, but there aren't any check about signle investigation score. only for flip the relative switch. so they can or cannot be relevant in the future. based on the information recovered skullpounder and nyst are the most important. skullpounder grant a +2 in orc competition if done the first occasion, so it's the prime option for the first target. for the best result in nyst event you don't need give mestan mana [if you help in the LL node battle], and refusing giving him mana is a rp +5, don't think the +5 for the dialogue will carry any value, but if fuzkao will be irrilevant one can dump that little shit and go for mestan. outside orc competition bonus and skullpounder/mestan block after anak gauntlet the order of the investigation are irrilevant. Mapping the tower give gathering influence +1, not only gauntlet +2. this don't change the useless of tower mapping in an optimized save, but perhaps a sub par one can find it more beneficial compared to investigate mestan and fuzkao

Second Gathering [v0.54.2]

Fulminato

Draft: https://www.dropbox.com/s/bua2nbw8gq9xl0k/2ndgathering.xlsx?dl=0
Mirror: http://www.mediafire.com/file/zs39j7yl2kdcsjk/2ndGathering.xlsx/file
More raw data:

First Part: https://pastebin.com/2TykQLvT
Second Part: https://pastebin.com/DBWsuVMe

v0.54.2 Changes:

Iris and Megail affection changes have been added to the results for the cooking event.
Orcsphere now increases the level of your orcs by 2 and gives +3 Balia Final Points, but Balia Final Points check thresholds have been changed to 23/20/17/11.
Error/Mistake/Missed:
Missing Orilise +2 for talking witrh her in the start of day 5 before interact with the armor.

v0.54.1 Change Spotted

Succubus Council:
a. Succubus Counicl score Gathering Influence threshold 15+ -> 16+
b. Slavery Check [15+|14-10|9-] -> [20+|19-12|11-]
c. Orgasmic Overall [30+|29-]:[lamia switch,Overall+1|-] -> [32+|31-28|27-]:[lamia switch,Overall+2|Overall+1|-]
DK Chamber: Riala {day7} -> Permanent Council [On|Off]: Riala [+5|+2]
Elite Fight: Add the ability to Escape Fight against Nalili's Team.
Anak Gauntlet: Open No Chest During the Race Gauntelt +2 -> +3
Nyst Battleground:
a. Blocked Item.
b. Starting Mana {400} + Harem [27|26-25|24|23|22|21-]: Mana [+250|+200|+150|+100|+50]
c. No interaction with LL && [Vunne Talk] On and End the section -> [Press LL|Non-aggression]: [Press LL On|Vunne Agreement, Vunne +2]
d. End Result: [Press LL] On : LL Node -1
Alabaster Hall {day7}:
a. Gathering Influence [20+|19-15|14-10|9-5|4-]: Gathering Overall [+6|+4|+2|+0|-1]
b. Gathering Rodak [10+|9-4|3-]: Gathering Overall[+2|+1|+0]
c. Gathering Orgasmic [15+|14-10|9-]: Gathering Overall[+2|+1|+0]
d. Gathering Philon [8+|7-3|2-]: Gathering Overall[+2|+1|+0]
e. Each IK investigation: Gathering Overall+1
f. Gathering Overall:
14+: Orgasmic {country} +3, Ghenalon +3, Erosia +1, Rodak {country} +1, Gathering Philon +4
13-11: [Light] On, Orgasmic {country} +1, Ghenalon +1, Gathering Philon +2
10-7: [Heavy] On, Orgasmic {country} -2, Ghenalon -1, Erosia -1, Rodak {country} -1, Gathering Philon -1
6-: [Heavy] On, Orgasmic {country} -5, Ghenalon -3, Erosia -2, Rodak {country} -2, Gathering Philon -3
Yhilin:
Dari 4th wheel 3+ -> Dari +5
Vunne 7+ && Gathering Rodak [5+|4-2|1-] -> LL Harem [Saved|Parital|None]

v0.54.0:

Last Resolution for Gathering Influence/Orgasmic/Rodak/Philon are missing the value
Changed the Orc Magic Threshold for Orc Competition [7/5/3 -> 8/6/4]
Add Gathering Rodak +2 to the choice to doesn't change Esthera Orgy (opposed to zirantian/slave plan)

v0.53.3 Change Spotted:

Best Result in Orc Solo Fight: Add , Gathering Influence +2
Reworked Impaler Buff for Tak'Kan Wild Kills From [ 2- | 3+ ] -> [ ATK+5/AGI+5 | --- ] to [5+ | 4-3 | 3- ] -> [ATK-5/AGI-5 |ATK+5/AGI+5 | ATK+10/AGI+10 ]
Change End Threshold for orc sapience from [ 9+ | 8-7 | 6-5 | 4- ] to [ 12+ | 11-10 | 9-8 | 7- ]
Change End Threshold for orc attractiveness from [ 8+ | 7-6 | 5-4 | 3-] to [ 9+ | 8-7 | 6-5 | 4- ]
Ginasta RP change for decision about Empress' Orgy: [ Slave Plan On | Zirantian Plan On | Both Off] -> Ginasta RP [+3|+1|-5]

v0.53.2 Change Spotted:

None in the Internal math.
Error Spotted:
From 0.53.1 Xestris will show up in the gauntlet recon section if [Orgy: Slave Plan] is On, not only [Orgy: Zirantian Plan] is On. both require the interaction with her during the erosia invasion.

v0.53.1 Change Spotted:

Fixed Orgasmic Empire Champion Switch [solo fight]
Added the Ability to "leave" the Battle with the Orgasmic Empire Champion [solo fight]
Added Tower Delving Research Done / Started: Anak Gauntlet +2/+1
Changed Score For Chests Open: [ 0 | 1-2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 ]: Anak Gauntlet [ +2 | +0 | +1 | +2 | +3 | +4 | +5 ]
Changed Final Score Threshold: From [ 11 | 10 | 9-8 | 7-6 | 5-3 | 2- ] To [ 13 | 12-11 | 10-9 | 8-6 | 5-3 | 2- ]

Error Spotted:

Going Through the Non Mandatory Examination Spell without Having Spot it is Anak Gauntlet -1
Chests Content Change Before and During the Race, Full List of Contents Added

Fulminato

Added the Second Part of the Gathering. End threshold are placeholder. Pan-Succubus Council will probably be an headache to optimize

Decanter

This comment by SL should be of interest to optimizers later:
"Certain things will happen with Philon no matter what, but your value influencing them will also be relevant in the future in a way that the others aren't."

Fulminato

Decanter This comment by SL should be of interest to optimizers later:
"Certain things will happen with Philon no matter what, but your value influencing them will also be relevant in the future in a way that the others aren't."

it's expected because in the "gathering overall" variable resolution (the last before returning to yhilin) there are some countries gains and "gathering philon" variable changes. so we will never see a philon country score.

at the moment the "orgasmic-philon trade agreement" is the hardest switch to reach.

FlayWind

Btw, what's the best order of the investigations? We have 6 targets and only 5 opportunities to do so. You can't talk to Mestan directly after the Anak's event. Also what happens with Skullpounder room after Tanurak replaces him?
Mestan only gives you 5 affection and +1 to Dari's counter. I guess he can be somewhat safely ignored, unless there's going to be a check soon that would require max possible affection with him. It's not clear how important Dari's counter is. Aside from that Fuzkao currently does not affect anything it seems, but maybe there will be a check in the future.

Fulminato

FlayWind Btw, what's the best order of the investigations? We have 6 targets and only 5 opportunities to do so. You can't talk to Mestan directly after the Anak's event. Also what happens with Skullpounder room after Tanurak replaces him?
Mestan only gives you 5 affection and +1 to Dari's counter. I guess he can be somewhat safely ignored, unless there's going to be a check soon that would require max possible affection with him. It's not clear how important Dari's counter is. Aside from that Fuzkao currently does not affect anything it seems, but maybe there will be a check in the future.

after anak gauntlet skullpounder room are blocked.
at the moment all investigation are equivalent, but there aren't any check about signle investigation score. only for flip the relative switch. so they can or cannot be relevant in the future.
based on the information recovered skullpounder and nyst are the most important. skullpounder grant a +2 in orc competition if done the first occasion, so it's the prime option for the first target.
for the best result in nyst event you don't need give mestan mana [if you help in the LL node battle], and refusing giving him mana is a rp +5, don't think the +5 for the dialogue will carry any value, but if fuzkao will be irrilevant one can dump that little shit and go for mestan.
outside orc competition bonus and skullpounder/mestan block after anak gauntlet the order of the investigation are irrilevant.
Mapping the tower give gathering influence +1, not only gauntlet +2. this don't change the useless of tower mapping in an optimized save, but perhaps a sub par one can find it more beneficial compared to investigate mestan and fuzkao

snusnumrik

So... What is the best strategy?
A
About investigations we have 6 targets plus Tower and 5 opportunities as the poster above said:
Fuzkao is the most useless
Also Tower exploration looks useless. It is a +1 to the Anak trial and that is it.

Skullpounder the most important
mestan gives a +5 that carries over so IMHO it is the most important.

Videospirit

Seems impossible to get absolutely every permanent bonus from the gathering. Have to choose between max Ginasta RP and max Mestan RP if you want to pass every check at the council and rescue the Lustlord's Harem and let the Orgasmic Champion win.

Decisions that matter:
Day 1: Support Lustlord or Support Anak, If you want to max ginasta RP you must support lustlord here but the -1 orgasmic score means you either need to spend the orgy with Esthera instead of Mestan or win the solo orc tournament to get 15 orgasmic+succubus for the slavery vote.
Day 2: You gain an orc contact if Orcent lets the orgasmic champion win which may be useful later, but you need the influence from winning the tournament to get gathering influence to 15 for the extra +1 Succubus council Day 6. You can easily get 8 Succubus Council with 13 gathering influence which is enough to pass all the votes if your Orgasmic gathering score is at least 7, but your orgasmic score will be 6 if you max both mestan and ginasta's rp. I'm assuming you max sapiance on your orcs, since that's been Simon's goal with the orcs all along and maxes philon score which is the one that matters in the future. You could max magic instead though but you'll need to make up for the lost orgasmic empire and philon gathering scores elsewhere but I won't mention the extra decisions that need to be changed if you go that route.
Day 3 Slave plan maxes Ginasta RP, but Zirantian plan is effectively +2 rodak +1 orgasmic empire in comparison, and if you do the zirantian plan you can side with anak day 1 for another +2 philon and +1 orgasmic since no point in more than 7 rodak score. Anak Room Succubus is important too, You can get an easy +1 orgasmic here if you did the slave plan or are going for magic orcs instead of sapiant orcs, but spending some time with Mestan here is a whopping +5 relationship points with Mestan.

Point on Day 6: I'm not actually sure what my Orgasmic Empire economic score ends up as in an optimal playthrough so It's possible I fail the OE Lamia check and need to readjust but pretty sure that score will be at least 13 which is all it needs to be to pass the check with slavery reform of 15.

Fulminato

Videospirit Seems impossible to get absolutely every permanent bonus from the gathering. Have to choose between max Ginasta RP and max Mestan RP if you want to pass every check at the council and rescue the Lustlord's Harem and let the Orgasmic Champion win.

if i understand correctly this is untrue. https://www.dropbox.com/s/ptpajjge3qefu5j/Try2.txt?dl=0
[you can shift the succubus in anak room from lustlord to mestand and take rodak dishes instead]

i don't know why you say "If you want to max ginasta RP you must support lustlord here but the -1 orgasmic score"

Videospirit

Fulminato

Hmm I guess that's what happens when I don't explore the magic orcs route at all. Philon score ends up just barely at 10 that way which might be a problem, but you do check all the boxes if you go magic orcs. That Day 1 choice is still mandatory to save the LL harem if you want to max sapience instead though. The orc scores could matter in the future too. Will have to come back and revisit based on what matters in the future but magic orcs seems to be the optimal route so far.

kobajagrande

Its obviously impossible to say anything before the final public version is released, but my planned set of choices (based on Fulminato's excel sheet) is:

First meeting: Hint to Esthera, Support Anak, Stay Silent, Extend an Olive Branch
Orc event: Maximize Sapience (prioritize civilization/add more knights), withdraw with Orcent vs Orgasmic champion, win everything else
Reduce Ziranthian presence (yes, a compromise, but I don't think 2 RP is too much to lose)
During Orgy send succubus to Mestan
Favor Rodakan dishes during last event

If my (admittedly very brief) calculations are correct, it hits all the points of the council and saves LL harem. Obviously no idea for the final calculation, but I suppose it will be ok.

The final question is about the investigations. The first is obviously Skullpounder, but for the second it depends how critical is the Tower Mapping for maxing Anak's event. If it can be maxed without it, then visiting Mestan is the clear choice.

Fulminato

kobajagrande The final question is about the investigations. The first is obviously Skullpounder, but for the second it depends how critical is the Tower Mapping for maxing Anak's event. If it can be maxed without it, then visiting Mestan is the clear choice.

without any tower mapping 'investigation", if you don't take any chest during the race and complete tower exploration research before the gathering (and go for zirantian/slave plan in the orgy) it required to complete the race in 30 sec (timer 9:30) to obtain the liquid sex.

FlayWind

When i was doing Anak's event i got the following:
+1 for Xestris, +1 for starting Tower Research earlier, +6 for finishing under 45 seconds and +5 for opening all the chests.

The_Scoutman

Gonna wait for the final balance, but I wonder if investigating the Skullpounder is really mandatory. Story-wise, considering he dies and Xestris reveals his secret to us anyway at the end of the gathering, maybe it would make sense to replace his investigation with someone else. Variable-wise, his help in the orc contest can be replaced with investigating the Lustlord or the LoB and the extra riala point from the runaway succubi seems superfluous.

Alternatively, the ones that would make the most sense to skip investigating would be Fuzkao or Mestan, skipping Mestan would lose 5 RP and miss one of Dari's 4th-wheel points, skipping Fuzkao makes sense for now, but I think investigating him could be helpful in the next open-world segment (knowing he is from Erosia, that he uses fire, and some of his personality could help us track him down).

Fulminato

The_Scoutman Gonna wait for the final balance, but I wonder if investigating the Skullpounder is really mandatory. Story-wise, considering he dies and Xestris reveals his secret to us anyway at the end of the gathering, maybe it would make sense to replace his investigation with someone else. Variable-wise, his help in the orc contest can be replaced with investigating the Lustlord or the LoB and the extra riala point from the runaway succubi seems superfluous.

runaway succubi flip a switch, "underling connection", and i think will be midly relevant in the future, similat to "orc connection" (the orgasmic champion you can spare in solo fight) and "lexande connection".

The_Scoutman Alternatively, the ones that would make the most sense to skip investigating would be Fuzkao or Mestan, skipping Mestan would lose 5 RP and miss one of Dari's 4th-wheel points, skipping Fuzkao makes sense for now, but I think investigating him could be helpful in the next open-world segment (knowing he is from Erosia, that he uses fire, and some of his personality could help us track him down).

fuzkao for now seem the most useless IK, in the gathering overall, not only in investigation. the use of fire magic it's obvious because he call himself "flamelord" and all the other information are scarcely relevant. he is a new IK with a little shard, for raw power shold be under harem combat ability, he don't know nothing about the tower nor seem a skilled mage. if we meet him again he will be crushed like the ant he is.

mapping the tower is a inferior choice, pehaps his gathering influence +1 can make the difference about a very subpar save, but this isn't the situation. so you skip one IK, i'm split between mestan and fuzkao (skullpounder investigation can still be relevant later and i value succubi switch more, for now). if you can spare the succubus in the orgy and send to mestan i think will skip mestan, the opposite otherwise.

Fulminato

Added the v0.54.1 Change. make pass OE slavery reform without sacrificing another major goal is nearly impossibile. [i works hours to achive it: https://www.dropbox.com/s/m1ub6fa3ml91t4b/Try3.txt?dl=0]
Alabaster Hall the best result is simply impossibile to hit, even the second best {[light collateral] On} is hard to reach for a optimized playthrough, i wonder if a blind play can avoid the worstt outcome...

Videospirit

Fulminato Compared to your final results I did the following changes to pass the Alabaster Hall Check
Slave Plan: Keep Original Event +2 Influence, +3 Rodak, +3 Orgasmic -5 Philon
Defeat Orc Champion +2 Influence
Sapient+Sapient Orcs: +4 Philon, -4 Orgasmic
Day1 Last: +2 Influence -2 Rodak
Dish Choice: +2 Influence -2 Rodak
Anak Succubus: +1 Rodak -1 Orgasmic

Gathering Influence: 21
Gathering Orgasmic 10
Gathering Rodak 5
Gathering Philon 9

Now If only I could figure out a way to swap that extra Influence point over to Orgasmic you'd at least pass the slavery reform in addition to everything else this achieves(So much fails to avoid collateral damage).

Alternatively you can tank the Philon score almost entirely to pass Slavery Reform.(Changes are comparison to my example above)
Day 1 Bickering Support Esthera +2 Orgasmic -1 Influence -2 Philon
Magic+Magic Orcs: -4 philon -1 Orgasmic +5 Rodak
Gathering Influence: 20
Gathering Orgasmic 11
Gathering Rodak 10
Gathering Philon 3

I for one am going to accept some collateral damage to Rodak until further notice instead though.

Fulminato

Videospirit gathering philon will became the informal philon country score after the gathering, reduce his value for minor gain in other part it seem unwise, the other scores probabily will be forgotten. we don't know if and how the miss zirantian/slave plan switch will affect future event, but i suppose we will find a couple of long lasting [and nasty] effects.

for avoid damage you basicaly sacrifice near all big result in the gathering, slavery reform stopped [even with 9 in succubus council you need gathering orgasmic 11], kill the orc in solo fight, OE-Philon trade doesn't pass as well [you need gathering philon 10]. the only other thing you achive is save all LL harem. and don't talk about the result about ginasta RP

Videospirit

Fulminato

Yeah it's definately a poor tradeoff, but it is physically possible to pass the check.